Aaron Build Hatch developed production. Hello, I'm Erin Kyle and welcome to another episode of Build Hatch. On this week's episode of Build Hatch, I had the pleasure of sitting down and speaking with Nick Lonsdale from Lonsdale building group in Melbourne. Nick was Victoria's young Builder of the Year in 2018. And since then has taken advantage of every opportunity that has come his way. On this week's episode, you'll hear about how Nick is not afraid to put himself out there while having the courage to back himself 100% and surround himself with good knowledgeable people and the importance of giving back. Next company is very active on social media channels. So I encourage you to check out their Instagram following this episode. This episode was recorded at Lonsdale building group's headquarters in Melbourne. And I really enjoyed sitting down talking with Nick and meetings wonderful team. Now let's get into it. So today we're recording at Lonsdale buildings headquarters, which is in Melbourne. And I really like the setup that we've got here. And we're at Nick's offices so young Builder of the Year 2018. So welcome to build X, Nick. Thanks, man. Thanks for having me. As always, with Build Hatch, we like to go back to the beginning and hear about I guess, where you grew up? What motivates you? So if we can take it back to the beginning whereabouts Did you grow up in Melbourne?
Nick
So northern suburbs. Originally Coburg, and then my parents separated were quite young, maybe around seven or eight years old. And we, my mum moved over to the north at Thomastown way. So for the most part, we were with her probably 80 85% of the time. She was a primary care. So we we grew up a lot out there from around that age upwards and stayed out north until I was about 22.
Aaron Okay, and growing up at school, did you have any aspirations to go into particular trade or university? What were you thinking back then?
Nick
I wasn't a very intellectual person. And school wasn't really for me. I spent most of my time at school socialising. I think like, I think I'm reasonably charismatic and get along with people quite well. So I spent most of my time talking to girls and hanging out with mates and probably not focusing on work as much as I should have. And so no, I didn't really have any aspirations at that stage, didn't really have any ideas was for me. Or for my brother and I, the 20% of time we spent with our dad, who now works for me, we'd go he purchased a small hobby farm just out of Dallas Fed central Victoria and quite dry and barren. So we would spend every second weekend up there. And that's where it really started. He's not a builder, but it just tinkerers and from from then to now probably renovated 10 houses. So that's where it kind of started for me.
Aaron So that was sort of a brief introduction into the practical aspects of it.
Nick
Yeah. And basically, an introduction to hard work. And he would say, you know, listen, you've always want a motorbike. every kid's dream doesn't matter as long as well, if you want that, three months, every single weekend for three months, you got to come up here. And whether it's walking up the trailer to the quad and driving around picking up rocks and trying to clean up attic or digging holes in a extremely volcanic area, or sheds and other bits and pieces and building stuff. That's what we do and just basically libraries for him and we would work.
Aaron And that I guess that's the introduction into not only the practical side of it, but also perhaps work ethic as well.
Nick
Yeah, definitely work ethic and, you know, getting getting something out of it. At the end of the day, getting a motorbike, getting some tangible, you know, come to the quick realisation that this life if you want something, you got to bust your ass to get it and he definitely did not make it easy for us. If anything is slave labour and underpaid, but
Aaron I bet you're thankful for that today. extremely thankful. Yeah, extremely thankful. Okay, so what about the introduction into construction? So from I guess, a bit of part time farm, sort of lifestyle and enjoying that practical aspect, how to how did you get into actual construction from there?
Nick
Yeah, so I believe it was your turn somewhere during the year 10. I basically got, I think, I think I went back to get I think it was maybe first semester a U turn. I went back to get my roster for the next semester and the principal said, you don't have a roster for next semester. Basically got what you Becky, you're like you're not doing anything, you just come in here for a bit of fun and hanging out. And that's not really what we want. So at least they were honest. Yeah, off you go and see you later. So I went, I went back and told mum and she wasn't very happy and and told dad and he was not very happy as well as you can imagine. And yeah, so it just said, well get yourself job straight up, you know, mom's Okay, well, you're not going to school, your pain board, so you better work out how to get some money. And from there, girl school was close friend. Her father was a fencing contractor. So timber piling fences. And he said, Yep, no worries come get on board. And so I went to work for him for I can't really remember the exact time I think it was maybe six months I really loved it. He loved me. Great guy to work for. And to start off, I wasn't allowed to use any tools, just lugging stuff around, which was alright, for me a bit of a competition of how many fence pilings you could lift or how many posts you could lift. But it didn't take very long to work out how to build a timber paling fence, you know, check out a string line, measure it out, dig some holes, like you're posting like you're browsing tracks and palings on your done. So in take too long, that I grew bored of it and realised that it kind of needed something more to stimulate me rather than just getting paid at the end of the week. So I started looking for an apprenticeship. And yeah, I was fortunate enough, this was an i, it seems so strange for me to even say this, but I found a job looking in a newspaper for a job, you know, this day and age, like you wouldn't have it but there was an advertisement for carpentry apprentices. And so I rang this guy up and and this fencing contractor would never start early. So it was like a 10 o'clock start. So it was ideal back then. So it was perfect. And I didn't really know anything about like real work apart from working with my dad on the weekends, didn't know anything about like, nine to five
Aaron schedules and time frames and what the time Yeah.
Nick
So I called up this guy and I said, Listen, I want to, I want to give it a crack and blah, blah. And he said, okay, no dramas, and tell me a bit about yourself on a deardon in. He said, radio on, I can't remember what the date was. But he said on Monday, and I was 17 at the time. And he said on Monday, I'll pick up the six. And I said shaming you mean six in the morning. He's like he was doing what you did laughing on the phone. Make sure you were standing out the front at six o'clock I was gonna be saying at the front of five to six do not be like so won't be waiting for you're not there. I'm gone. And treated for me rocked up like you and trailer on the back tradies trailer and off we went. And that was one of the hardest days of my life or better was he had a mission to try and break me. And we worked out in Craigieburn volume houses framing stick framing with a Truss Roof, prefab Truss Roof, and he just absolutely grinded. We started, he picked me up at six, and I was half an hour away, start at 630. We then stopped at eight o'clock. And my mum was waiting in the car. And I got in the car and she said you are not going back to work for this guy. No way. But yeah, that's where it started. And I continued on with him. And he was he was another. I've been I've been blessed with some extremely great role models might not have came across personally wise, but work wise and work ethic. I've been I couldn't be happier with with the people that got put in front of me. And that's what's really made a difference.
Aaron And don't you think I mean, construction, it's nice to be able to say that there is that? A little bit of old school mentality left. And although you don't appreciate it at the time pounding the pavement and doing those hard yards, you come to appreciate it down the track.
Nick
Yeah. So much. So there's nothing more especially now. There's nothing more than I love to get out on site on a Saturday and do some work, you know, always not so much this year. But last year, every Saturday, I'd go out with my tip truck and do site cleans on a Saturday, you know, these, that's probably the job that you need the least amount to really think about that, that, for me such a good release in just, you know, being out there seeing what's going on with the boys and the jobs and loading stuff up. And it's a bit of that old, old school mentality where you just gotta put in a bit of elbow grease and you know, get it done. Yeah, look,
Aaron I did a similar thing. And being a Saturday. My head was a lot clearer when I was building that that is and I could actually take the kids along or my wife along and they get a bit of an insight into that work. ethic. Yeah, what Dad's actually doing. Yeah, a bit of appreciation into it is a lot of camber. Yeah. And earning their stripes with that elbow grease that you referred to.
Nick
Yeah, yeah. And best thing about a Saturday for me is that the phone goes down to about 20% of what it normally is Monday to Friday. So it's just fantastic not to have that in the background and going on.
Aaron Okay, so from there, I guess you were putting along and you came up with the, I guess the motivation and concept behind establishing your own construction company? How far were you through, I guess, in the construction process to come up with that idea working for yourself?
Nick
Well, it happened pretty early on for me. A good mate of mine, who also at the same time was going to the same school, best mates. Italian guy spent a lot of time with his family, he also got asked to leave. So I was going to the job. He went did an apprenticeship as well. And very early on. I just worked because I've had I've worked with my old man on the farm, or he was a clothing wholesaler as well. So whenever we went on the farm we're in. He'd had these little pop up shops in the country for two weeks. And he put us there Saturday and Sunday at work. And you know, so we'd learned a little bit about money and all the rest of it. And literally, we're 1413 year old, always just been lifted to our own devices. Sounds crazy. But it was it was. So I kind of knew I just knew that I could make money. And I was always thinking about making money. Because where I grew up, within, like, when my parents got divorced, my mom chose not to go to work, she chose to dedicate her life to the church. And, you know, we were tithes and offering giving her money she didn't have to the church. And we didn't spend much time with my dad only like 20% of time. So we didn't have a lot of money. So if we wanted something, we kind of needed to make some money to get it. And this is through dad. So I was happy to work weekends. So during my first year, someone would ask you, can you build a deck? Can you build a pergola? Can you build this? Can you build that? And me being the person I am? Yep. I just say yes to everything. And if I wasn't confident enough to build it, then I'd ask my mate, who was also a first year apprentice, but doing different components of the building industry, if he knew how to do it, and generally one of us would have half an idea and, you know, we'd put in, get it done. Or if we didn't, then I'd ask, you know, one of the contractors, can you explain this? Can you come out for a day and work with us, I'll pay you, which is always a bit weird for an apprenticeship be paying savvy, but that happens and just kind of went on from there. So I went through the whole apprenticeship thing, I started sub contracting, I didn't finish my apprenticeship. I started sub contracting. I think third year through it, I got an offer from a builder, who I think is offering me like 200 bucks a day. And I was like, Whoa, this is great. You know, my first year I got paid for auto was 26. Now, my first year, so I think it was almost a third year or just on third you guys offer me 200 bucks today is an amazing opportunity. Yeah, I'm thinking, wow, this is fantastic. So he just doesn't want to deal with paying an apprentice and all the bullshit that goes along with it. So yeah, I jumped on with him and went through that. And I learn a few a fair bit from him. And it was just the same thing, a little bit of natural progression. And then I met a gentleman and out of like, his name was Jack, he was about 60 odd and he was doing maintenance for real estate agents, houses, and I built. I built a pergola for his son, and then he asked me to come and build a pergola at his place. And then he asked me to give him a hand with a maintenance type stuff. And we became, you could call it a business partner or just working with each other for a year or two months. That was that was really one of the best parts about my career working as this maintenance guy, because I got to see every facet of a house, generally after it's finished, and all the stuff that have gone wrong with it. And also how to fix all that stuff. So you really get a good insight into how the mechanics and everything worked. And that's how generally that's how it naturally progresses from there. Someone asked me to come and supervise for townhouses. So I jumped on that. And I did all the carpentry on that with a couple other guys while supervising at the same time. And just slowly, slowly, slowly, it led from there more carpentry for a few years and, and helping out supervising. And then if I remember correctly, one of my best mates mother's is an architect. And she had a small job. She said, You want to price this job? Like, wow, never really lost a job before I don't really know what to do with it. But
Aaron clearly, you'd said yes, every opportunity up until this point, yeah, so why say no, then
Nick
why not? I'll have a crack at it. You know, I had a, I've got a, I've got to make now who owns a quantity surveying firm in the city. And I'm pretty big, firm. And because of the way that I grew up, and I started my trade, and then I started working for other people on the side, the way that I broke things down, working out a bill of quantities, when you had a quote, things was literally, how long is it going to take physically take me or take me and whoever labour wise, what is the material cost? And then is that percentage of call a builder's margin these days, or whatever you want to profit back, then you kind of gauge that on the person and, and work it out from there. So which is quite different to the way I do it these days, you know, we use rates and all that. Yeah. So
Aaron I guess what you've actually done is you've applied a practical approach of you've tried to come up with a practical way of solving a problem in your room. So you've done what you could at the time, the resources that you have, you've asked people if you didn't know the answer to a problem. But you've then gone another step and tried to come up with an actual way of sorting it or looking at in your own perspective, to work it out.
Nick
Yeah, definitely, you have to, you know, just gotta use the resources that you have, whether they're physical resources, or their mental resources, you just got it, you got to use what you've got. And, you know, I look back, look back on it now. And while I hate making mistakes, I also love making mistakes, because they're the only way you learn, and when it's your own money, you know, you got to you got to honour it, you know, there's, there's been plenty of fuck ups. It's just human error. You gotta you gotta honour whatever you do, that's a big part of it, if you got to work a day for free, or if something you know, these days cost you 10 grand, well, you know, be a man about it and honour it. And then it's, it's that word of mouth is that honouring that one makes me feel good and sleep good at night, or two, if for whatever reason a subcontractor, or supplier, or a client or a client's friend says that he's that? Well, it just, you know, holds you in such good stead. So you work out what you need to do, and you go from there. And so, just for me, I started pricing this job. And she was great. The architect, Julie, her name was she helped me even you know, price and coach me a little bit. And, you know, since then I've done a heap of jobs for her. And it's been fantastic. She really gave me a kickstart, and gave me a confidence boost. To start progressing into the rest of my career. From there, I picked up a build for an old Greg gentleman. And that was pretty challenging. And he was pretty challenging as a client. And that was the first type real build. So it was, you know, it's terrible to have challenging clients and, and hard jobs to work on. But when you look back on, they're some of the best because, you know, you take back what you've learnt from that, and then you implement it into the next job. And that's,
Aaron that's the important ingredient in the whole concept. And that is, if you don't learn something from those really bad situations, and as you said, sometimes we will have to suck it up, ate a shit sandwich now and then as they say, and but if you don't learn and reflect on what went wrong, whether it was a planning issue or personnel issue or resource problem, then it's no good to anyone moving forward. But if you can learn from it, and apply it and incorporate it into your business, whether it's a system solution or a resources solution, then it puts you in a great position moving forward.
Nick
Yeah, doesn't you know, from time to time you forget a mistake that you made years ago and things pop up in the reminder of it, but a lot of people ask me these days, who's my competition? Always everyone wants to know who their competition you know, when you and I have gone through a lot of our social media and our kind of approach to what we do in marketing. I don't really call it marketing, but you know, they always ask you that, that question Who's your competition? And for me, the I don't really care what anyone else is doing. I definitely get inspired. by other builders, but Mike, my competition is myself being a better version of myself. And that's where it comes back to, you know, owning your mistakes and wanting to be a better version of yourself. And if you can keep doing that, that's what's got me going, you know, no one pisses me off more than I pissed myself off and get frustrated with my mistakes, but at the same time, I love it because I know I'm going to take it up a notch next time around.
Aaron So when you began with Lonsdale building group, what was your vision back then?
Nick
Yeah, it's quite funny, growing up north in Thomastown. And, and, you know, you've got totally different dreams and aspirations living out there, and living here and totally different opportunities in into debt to Nicola woods. So, my aspirations back then, were the Aussie dream, you know, buy a house for 250 grand, and pay the sucker off. And, you know, as my you or whatever car was to get around, and then have a cool, you know, RC car. So, that was my aspirations of myself. And in that intertwining that East Lonsdale building grew up, you know, just having a company that I didn't really have a goal other than, you know, providing for myself and my future family. And it wasn't until long till I met a friend who's a guy who's my best mate has been my best mate for the past 1011 years, that really gave me some inspiration. I always had this thing because of the way that we grew up with a lack of funds. You know, I just wanted to be successful. Just one. And I didn't even know what successful was, but I just, you know,
Aaron had to get out of that, that that was fighting. That was fighting yourself. Yeah, obviously.
Nick
Yeah. And, and then. So when I met this guy, Brooke, who's now I speak to him every day, FaceTime every single day, if not, probably three or four times a day. My best mates we have been since though we met. And he really inspired me. And one thing that he I had a, I got a couple of jobs over here, that one from Julie that was in Hawthorne, and then another one in huntingdale, just down the road here. And, you know, one of the first things that he said to me work related was, you should really try and get work over this side of town. Because I think I think something was happening financially with the world at that time, I think it was just after GFC. And he said, you know, doesn't matter what recession we go through in the world, there are particular suburbs, or particular parts of any community that will always keep spending and for you for building, if you were to work in there in the southeast, Terrax at the moment, Ahmed, Al, all these areas, you can establish a good name for yourself and a good reputation. These guys are always going to keep spending.
Aaron That's right. And it could be in good times it might be that they might be knocking down and doing rebuilds or in the tighter times during recessions, they might it might be alterations and additions. So
Nick
yes. So that's, you know, that's, that's what inspired me. And that's, that's basically what made me take the move to move from the north into the southeast. And it was massive for me because I, you know, I grew up on my wife out north and to move from move from something you know, your home, or your friends and kind of leave something behind. It felt like I was going overseas. I would come over here. I didn't even know where the Botanical Gardens was. Seriously, I had never been to the Botanical Gardens. I didn't know anything about it. I know where any of the streets were Park Road, I couldn't even work out where bloody chapel straight was. And it was, it was the laughingstock of all the boys at the start for the first 12 months to figure out where the hell I was going. Yeah, that's when I made that big move. That's when my goals and dreams and aspirations started to change. When you can kind of get a sense of things that you can achieve and things make a difference.
Aaron Alright, so back then were you doing everything like bookkeeping and quotes and everything else that goes with it?
Nick
Yeah. You have to You start off as a tradie got really no choice. You have to do all that kind of stuff and definitely not a strong point of mind was the whole paying the tax on time. Working out all your work is just like when you when you're young. Nobody can try and have a crack not not being educated in it in any of these facets. You just when it comes in, money, buy some tools go out. It is do that. So it's just a natural progression that you learn how got to deal with all these things because, you know, they all come up at one point or another and you've got to educate yourself on how to do it. So yeah, I definitely have been through all the different processes of the building industry and learnt myself. And, you know, when I had when I've had enough work, and enough funds, you know, you employ someone who can do that job better than you can sell frees you up to do whatever you're good at. So yeah, bookkeeping, estimating contract administration, you know, everything from working on the tools, and doing all that after hours into 10 o'clock, 11 o'clock at night, and just, you know, busting your ass, you've just got to do it.
Aaron Now, you mentioned before about your close network of people and who you talk to and surround yourself with, who do you actually consult with when making those big decisions?
Nick
Probably, my dad, I speak to my dad more so. So he's just joined the team probably about six months ago. And I speak to him more so about the building operation side of things on site, and the guys. And then I've got a handful of other friends that I'll speak to about, you know, bigger building decisions, or bigger company decisions or buying a development or how to how to deal with different people and different clients. I'm pretty fortunate. But a lot of put a lot of effort into my friends, my family, staff, I'll go the extra mile for everybody. And I'll always help everyone out. And so, and that's never been intentionally, that's just been what I've done. So when I've gone through times of crisis, I generally try and keep as many things to myself, and don't put too many things out there to the point where when people can say that I'm stressed, that's when I'm like, almost a breaking point. And then I'll just start to talk and start to work things out. And I've got a lot of people that I can lean on, I've got a lot of different people in a lot of different fields, you know, from lawyers, accountants, psychologists, you know, you name it, I've got a lot of friends. And that's only because I've been fortunate, I've worked for a lot of people, I've built a lot of relationships from having previous clients. So unfortunate that I can lean on a lot of people and help me make decisions. But my best mate, Brooke is like, out of this world, personality, super crazy. does extremely well for himself. High energy and super intelligent is like a walking calculator can spit numbers as they come out. And he's been a massive impact in my life and still someone that I speak to about every decision and get a different perspective on it.
Aaron Certainly. And so I mentioned at the beginning with the introduction that you became young Builder of the Year in 2018. What was what was that like winning that?
Nick
That was amazing. It was a really a massive pivotal point in my career. And I think it's probably going to be to be a massive turning point. For me. That was great recognition for everything that I'd done, you know, just all those days and Saturdays and Sundays and finishing at six and whatever late at night. That's, that's, that's what it was. for me. It was that accomplishment for that that really made it right for me. So getting that recognition was was great. And it was very overwhelming. You know, I haven't teared up when I got home. And it's just like, wow, it's
Aaron just overwhelming. Yeah,
Nick
I didn't think that always had any chance of winning it always just, you know, almost fell over when I rang me and said, you know, the judges have nominated you for this award as a joke. It was just incredible. With the flow on effect for that. inspiration that I got from that was what the pivotal moment was for me. And it was setting a standard. And one of the one of the main judges, Frank, I'm not sure what his last name is. But he said to me, as I walked out of the ballroom that night, he said, I put a lot of trust in you do not fuck this up. Okay, it's massive, but, you know, it meant a lot for him to be choosing someone, you know, being myself. And I don't want to let anyone down. And I took that on as a challenge that I wanted to make sure from this point onwards, it's like, okay, if everyone thinks we're at a good standard, now, I know I can go. We can go up another level 10 more notches from where we are now. So let's really gear it up. And let's go to the next level. And it's been a massive change in the last few years massive
Aaron and at some point, you were approached to participate in sort of TV production shows and in the light of How did that come about?
Nick
So yeah, that was that was definitely off the back of that. So the Master Builders Association of Victoria, and myself, we grew tight because that, you know, I really appreciated that award and really appreciated everything that I've done. So I kept in contact with them, and their marketing person at the time, she was lovely. And I just said, you know, if you ever need anything from me, I'm more than happy to you know, give back where I can in anything, you know, whether it's next year talking to get these guys to get nominated or whoever, whatever you need, just reach out and I'll be there for you guys. And one day they rang up and said, Listen, with sponsoring the show, healthy homes, the host is wall Collins. They certainly other thing, and we'd love you to feature in that with him. So we're basically buying a time slot on that to promote Master Builders Association. Victoria, we want you to be the face of that. And I was like, Jesus Christ, this is a day. Wow, it makes a lot of responsibility. So yeah, they just said he'll get in contact with do you want to do it? And I get okay. No worries, of course, I want to do it. You know, it's great. Say right on it for me. And, you know, it's gonna benefit me, like ridiculously, I think are good, and why not? So a couple weeks later, we organised he came out to do an episode of healthy homes. And he said, Can I come out? And when he drops us, we'll get this one. We've done some demolition at the moment, come out, set up. And, yeah, we just got talking. And, you know, I'd had their videographer on for, I don't know, maybe six months. So I had just started to become comfortable with the camera. And it's something that does not come easy to me. I mean, a lot of people now say it looks you look so natural. But it's been almost two years of being in front of the camera practising.
Aaron And that's certainly not an easy task, is it? I mean, being on camera adds a whole new dimension, including extra effort and focus, doesn't it?
Nick
Yeah. All that kind of stuff. And so, you know, I was probably six months into that. And what was extremely accommodating, and it made me feel so comfortable and relaxed. And when he's
Aaron a real character you don't really reliable and yeah, if Alaric. And
Nick
yeah, and yeah, we just got along really well. And so it just went from there. We did that episode. And then, you know, he obviously had my phone number from the master builders. And he told me three or four days later and said, mate, listen, I'm actually editing this at the moment. And you've really come across, well, you've really come across naturally, then you did a great job. How do you feel about jumping on a couple of episodes, healthy homes, and then you know, being being the builder for this season? I think they do five or six episodes 100% I'll be honest, I said, you know, we're happy to pay you X amount, an episode. And I just said, Listen, I'm not interested in the money, I'm happy just to come out and be a part of it and really honour and respect you for reaching me and asked me for that. I don't need the money. I'll come up with a pilot, same, just get it done and have a bit of fun with it. And, you know, I've never done that for him before. So from there, you know, I just grew a bit of respect. And we just did a few episodes and just went from there. And you know, sort of every now and again now I'm still their chosen builder for their healthy homes. And whenever they've got an episode that needs need to build on it. I'm the guy that gets called up. That's been two years of whatnot, hanging out and becoming good mates. And yeah, we are really good mates. We expect three or four times a week is as crazy as he comes across on my social media platform. That's crazy. That's just him in real life. He's very quick witted is fun, you know? He's extremely loving and caring of everybody. Yes. So that's how that came about.
Aaron And isn't it amazing to look back but it just goes to show that consistently saying yes to opportunities as they present themselves. It's amazing where, where it could go.
Nick
Yeah. Once again, that goes back to my childhood, and growing up and not having a lot of opportunities to say yes to and kind of forging your way which is fantastic. And everyone's got their own story and everyone comes from their background, but for me, that's what it was. And so when I was when I got to a certain point, I think I was about 22 I was just like, Okay, if things come up. I just need to say yes, just need to be involved. You know, give it a crack, whether you're making money or not making money and opportunities and up to charity, you got to look, you can't just look at the short term, you got to look at the long term, and you've got to put in. And you know, I've done a lot of free work for people. $150,000 Worth I did for one guy, and, you know, people were saying to me like, this is a lot of time you, you're getting involved in doing this, and, you know, you put in for 12 months, and this and that, and, and, you know, at the end of the day, I shouldn't be doing this at the end of day for me, you know, it's 10 years down the track. And that's what I did back then for that amount of money, which everyone thought I was crazy, you know, managing this job on the side, and the amount of pressure put on me, it's paid dividends. So people are going to be able to see through the fog of the short term and look, you know, long distance, choose the people that you want to hang around with, get people that inspire you that you aspire to be like, and you know, your bottom line, I go a risk.
Aaron And I mean, and that that ties in with the theme of this podcast, which is, you know, we have this saying on build house that a picture tells 1000 words, but it doesn't tell the full story. And people listen to this need to be aware of that and be reminded of how important it is to not necessarily be focused or driven by the dollar. But if you can just give and help and develop a working relationship. It's a long term game, it's not a short term or overnight game, and people are focused in that short term space, it doesn't last or doesn't seem to last, particularly from where I sit in the issues that I see.
Nick
Yeah, it's definitely detrimental. detrimental to everything is detrimental, the friendships, relationships, work wise, I mean, obviously, you got to keep yourself focused and make sure you've got food on the table and make sure you're you know, making money and doing all those things. But if you just always focused on the short term, it's just not going to be good for your long term, it's pretty simple. And you're not going to be able to reach the goals and the things you want to reach without investing in other opportunities, and putting yourself out there.
Aaron So fast forward to, I guess, the opportunity that you had with healthy homes, what did that opportunity do to your business? Besides helping them with their projects? What did it actually due to your business?
Nick
Okay, so I get this question a lot in a roundabout way about a lot of stuff that we do. Obviously, we're flooded out on social media, majorly, probably Instagram, we're also trying to get some other stuff up and going at the moment we're working on in the background. And you can't necessarily say that one thing in particular, in this kind of, in this kind of space, like, social media wise, and I'll put that into, into that category gets you anywhere in particular, but it's everything combined. That makes us at assess success, little things that add up, yeah, everything adds up, you know, it's from, it's from when, when a client is choosing a builder, you've submitted a quote, you've gone there, you've put forward your quotation, a lot of time, then these guys go on, you know, I try my best to work out to get a good vibe going, you can get a good vibe going if, if those guys then go and research you, and see all these things that you've done, you know, the way that you run your social media, the fact that you've, you know, you've been trustworthy enough to be on a TV show about building and people are watching that and taking your word for gospel, got a good website, all these other bits and pieces that go along with it, along with that word of mouth. That's how we get most of our works or word of mouth. So along with that, it seals the deal. So that's how that's impacted on my life, I suppose with the Healthy Home stuff. And it's just fun. It's fun, you know, it's it's good hanging out, it's good. And it's a totally different thing, even though we're doing building stuff. It's, it's a totally different job for me when I go there. And, you know, we're hanging out with Walt and Danny and the film crew and everyone else that goes into it. It's a challenge for me, because, you know, I've done it probably, I don't know, five or six times now. I don't know what the fuck I'm doing. I got no idea. And these guys kind of look at you and expect you to know what you're doing. Because you know, you're doing good wise, but you really got no idea. So it's a challenge to me. Listen to everybody. You know, I'm like the apprentice out there. Again. I'm trying to take everything on board. Try not to make mistakes. And Walter totally different person when he's filming. When he's filming his show. He is like, he's just so like, a bloody sergeant. And he's not not scared and will not hold back to pull someone up or yell at someone. He so he's particular he's meticulous. He wants everything done. 110% So you know awesome. So having that in the back of your mind to, for me, I don't want to fuck up and make a mistake. So yeah, it's a good challenge about there to learn a different skill and putting in with him and doing that, at no cost, he helps me. This is more of a long term thing game, you know, I, I just put it out there cuz I didn't want to get paid. I didn't want to do any others thankful for the opportunity. Now the same token is then helped me and teach me how to be better in front of the camera how to come across better have a you know, so people can be relatable to me, or I can be relatable to them. So it's all it's all those things that have come? You know, I can't
Aaron read that up. Yeah. All right, Nick. So at some point, I guess, being a builder and having the career that you've had, eventually, it's only natural at some point that you enter into the property development space. So how did you sort of transition into that?
Nick
I wouldn't say I'm fully transitioned or fully seasoned property developer, not by any stretch of the imagination. But yeah, it is. It is a natural progression, I suppose for any trade, particularly a carpenter, who goes on to be a builder to do some form of property development. I think anyone that doesn't do it is mad. But it is, there is no secrets. And it is hard. It's very different, isn't it? It is totally different to what everybody thinks it is. It's not just,
Aaron it looks glamorous. On the surface. Yeah. And but it's not
Nick
developers make so much money. And it's all this and not all that. And it's like, now looking back, it's like Jesus would have been just easier to do client work and kind of that continued money to come in. But it's a different facet. It's something I would encourage everyone to getting involved with. But you just got to, you got to learn this, there's a lot more in it than just knocking up a house or renovating a house or going down a house and building a couple of townhouses. This is where trainees get unstuck, because it's, it's the research, it's the paperwork, that actually makes the development, building, renovating, doing whatever it is, to the property that you're going to do is by far, the easiest part.
Aaron Yeah, it's it's rather the process than the actual product.
Nick
Yeah, yeah. And, you know, you're saying before that you've got a couple of some of your followers, not from Australia, and I can't speak for other countries, but in or even other states. But I know Australia is pretty pretty well, the same with the housing market at the moment. The issue that we're facing now, for property developers, the hardest part is the buy. It used to be, you know, the buyer used to be the easy part. But now, this is where all the research is gonna go in. Because everybody's worked out that they can be a property developer, every mom and dad can be a property developer, because they, you know, the baby boomers have bought everything and they're sitting on a block, and they can develop it. So it's, it's really the buyer and doing your research on the comparative sales and making sure that you know, your build costs of roughly what you want to build, and all the other secret little costs that go into it, and the levies from the council, and everything, and putting all those things down in an Excel spreadsheet, and going to speak to someone who can give you a bit of advice on making sure that all these numbers actually stuck. And then at the end of the day, you want to make sure that you know, for me, at the end of the day, when I'm doing any sort of development. My number one rule is we'll make 20% On paper, it's got to make 20% on paper. Now that goes that allows you to go either way, you know, that allows you hopefully not to go under 10% that allows you to hopefully grow up to 30%. And that's great. But that's that's a really good position to be at that you want to make them. So that the biggest thing in property development is the homework upfront before you buy the house. And it is painful. And I reckon, you know, I've created my own feasibility study feasibility spreadsheet in Excel that took me two years and was cost me a fortune I deal with a mate of mine, who's a forensic accountant. And we went over things and over things and over things, and I've done a few developments now where I've worked out where my stakes were, and we've added those things in. It's just about doing your research as much as you can. I've probably done maybe six, seven different developments now. Yeah, the things that you learn through that and change or just you know, is astronomical and some of those haven't worked out. Some of those I've lost a shit tonne of money on like serious shit tonne of money on from things that I couldn't control being the man market crashed being lending that stopped happening, paying stamp duty, you know, and I wasn't researched enough, but you know, now it's different. And now you try and make sure that you cover everything as much as you possibly can.
Aaron How do you handle that transition from becoming a builder to a developer? Is it for the average person? Is it a case of renovating and selling, building up getting bigger than maybe moving on to townhouses and going from there? Or is it more about surrounding yourself with decent people and your network and, and sort of dabbling into medium sized projects?
Nick
Yeah, I think it's everything combined, definitely need good people around you, you need a good real estate agent. And what you got to remember with every real estate agent, is they're still a real estate agent. They still do the things that everyone does. But you definitely need a good one of those. You need good people around you. I mean, in regards to projects, that's really hard. One of my other best mates or friends, a property developer, doesn't awesome stuff, really super, super high end stuff. And I catch up with him. Not every day, every second day, we go for a lap around the tan now. Now I know where it is. 1012 years on, and he does stuff like he's got, he's got a project, it's the build cost is 150 million. He's just about to start in July. And you know, we have this discussion regularly, he started off doing one house renovating a house, doing, you know, building a new house doing some jewel locks doing a couple of townhouses, and he naturally grew, but it's a regular conversation, he's so hard that a lot of times we talk about, Hey, I just really wish that I could just do the jaw locks. Again, once I get out of this project, I'm just going to chill out for a couple of years and just do a couple of jaw locks. Because that was probably the most profitable portion of it, you got to find your niche and gotta find what you're good at, you know, if you're, if you're a builder that doesn't necessarily have massive ambitions, but wants to make a little bit of money on the side, then, you know, buy a place and renovate it you crazy, a lot of a lot of traders want to do this and get stuck. And the reason they get stuck is because they don't pay their fucking tax or everyone's trying to hide money from the tax man. Because you know, pay less tax, and it's great. But these days getting a loan, it's all about serviceability. So you want to make more money, pay more tax. That's right, it's a hard mentality to get into. But it's honestly, if you want to have ambitions, and you're trading in your ability to pay more tax, so you can borrow more money, if you can borrow more money, you're gonna have the opportunity to you know, buy a more expensive place and build something more expensive in a better area than what you're at. Those people in that area have generally got more money to spend, if they fall in love with that project that you've done a seriously fall in love that they're happy to pay, you know, whether it's 20, or 200, grand more than next person just to have your project. So it all comes back to mentality.
Aaron I think it's important to note too, when you are making that transition or combining your business from being not just to build a bit of property developer, you're really stepping up your name, and image and reputation as well. And people would be surprised to know, but there are a lot of people that aren't just looking at buying an apartment or, or a particular building, they want to know who's built it. And there's a lot of repeat buyers as well. So there's a fine line between being a great builder and a great property developer, there are two very different aspects. And yeah, it's another step up in terms of name reputation, and another completely entire dynamic, really,
Nick
yeah, and that's definitely something that that I've thought about and that my business models definitely worked around between the period of five to 10 years I want to be doing, I want to be just doing my own projects, my own developments. I've got a small group of investors, which I hope to grow off the back of doing a couple of good projects like we have. And you're exactly right, I want to still be able to build my own developments. Because there is at the moment, in my area, there is a stigma around when someone sees one of our jobs, they know it's quality. And then when they look at our social media platforms, they can see you know, the whole build process and they see how clean our sites are and they see the quality of work that we do. There is a there's an architect in in Melbourne, which you know, I hide it hold in high regard, Rob Mills,
Aaron and Rob mills. He designs incredible projects in the south eastern suburb belts that we'll talk about earlier,
Nick
the best spots, the most expensive houses, and I've got a few friends that know him. And when I first came over here and was driving around South Yarra to rock Armidale. It will say, that's a ROB Mills house, that's a ROB Mills house. And for me, I have always had this dream that I want people to be able to drive past one of my developments and say, that's, that's a long style. That's one of the long styles developments. That's a long style development. Yeah, that's definitely something that I aspire to. So I've got to make sure that I know I can handle the quality side of things and build side of things, for me a bit of the challenges of the design, and finding a design that fits with what we're trying to build here. So that's certainly when we will do when we were working through the design phase of our project in Melbourne. So at the moment, something that definitely came up and consideration if you can, depending on the areas that you're building on, if you can work on that. And if you plan on being in this game for the period that I plan on being it for, you know, then you might as well have your own tweaks or plays on a development so that over time people know.
Aaron Absolutely. Alright, Nick, looking back now at that 15 year old boy that got to know from a teacher saying you're not going to cut it off, you go into the real world, what's it like looking back now wouldn't
Nick
really change anything really, I actually would have changed a few things. But you know, that was still a great stepping stone. I think when I was 13, I got approached, my mom got approached by a carpenter, who is building a department store. They said, You know, I'll give you some because I were talking about how I was no good at school, said, I'll give you some, I'll give you a job. And my mom said no. And that's probably the only thing that I would change. I just wish I was 10 years older than I am. I wish I started this 10 years before, you know, the property market. From a development developers point of view. If I could have gotten in 10 years earlier, there would have been, you know, a lot more opportunities with my head was at where it's at now 10 years ago. So older like that fact. But I wouldn't change too many things, you know, as much as the hard work and the upbringing that we had was not ideal. It wasn't ideal at the time. But as for the situation where I'm at now, it was ideal to make me who I am.
Aaron Alright. Now, if people listen to this one and get into contact with it, besides your social media channels, which are quite busy at the moment, what's the best way to go about it?
Nick
Yeah, I'm a big fan of giving back. So I talk to a lot of people on social media, people reach out from time to time, have a chat and catch up about things. And, you know, like I said to you at the start of this, and you're asking me about what you can and can't talk about. And I said just talk about anything comes to mind, I don't really care. I'm an open book, I'm happy to talk to people, if they need advice, or if they've got something that's happening, they just need to know I've gone through some really ship times. And I've gone through some fantastic times, there's more way more good times and bad times. In regards to getting in touch with this. You know, we've got Facebook, Instagram, you know, feel free to drop me an email. It's pretty easy to get my phone number because it's all over everything that we've got. So even give me a call. The call is probably the probably the least least one that works for me because I get so many calls every day, you know, 150 200 phone calls every day. But yeah, text message anyway, I don't really mind if someone needs a bit of help, or guidance, someone to talk to about something. Well, I'm happy to anyone to reach out.
Aaron Well, Nick, really appreciate you coming on to Build Hatch. It's been truly inspiring to hear your journey from that 15 year old kid, finding himself in the real world to now owning and operating your very own successful building company. So thanks again. It was great to have you on this week show.
Nick
No worries. I appreciate you reaching out to me and giving back to everyone else there is out there. And you know, this is a great way to help everyone hopefully learn from other people's experiences and have a better version of themselves. So well done. Appreciate
Aaron it. Thanks, Nick. Well, that was Nick Lonsdale from Lonsdale building group in Melbourne. What I liked about sitting down and speaking with Nick, is he's not afraid to put himself out there. And that's not an easy thing to do in construction land. In building, there are a lot of things going on day to day. So being able to build a great product, put the right resources into play, and market yourself in a way that Nick has been able to do is truly extraordinary. Have a great week and you'll hear me on the airwaves again next week. Thanks for listening to another episode of build hack. You have experienced our builds have developed production
